Thursday, September 9, 2010

Au876 on Financial Control, Part 2

(Continuing with a “best of” compilation from a wife-led husband who, at the turn of this century, was the mainstay of Lady Misato’s original Yahoo! Husbands’ forum. This two-parter focuses in on what Au sees as the advantages, and disadvantages, of a husband surrendering all financial control to his wife. I must say, reading these diary-type admissions came as a shock to me all those years ago. Here was a husband for whom wife-worship, or a wife-led marriage, was no fantasy, but daily reality. It was not a matter of surrendering physical control to some fantasy domina for an hour, but total control over all aspects of his daily life to the woman he loved, honored, worshipped and obeyed.)

Au876 on Financial Control, Part 2:

Did He Give Up Control, or Did She Simply Take It?

In our relationship I never have any thoughts now about what control I will give her or not. I can't recall that I ever did. She took control and I learned that submitting to her was pleasurable, rewarding and fulfilled me as a man.

A few of us have posted saying we draw the line at financial control. My wife did not give me that choice. She took financial control, she did not ask for it. However, if she controls you and you control the money, then that means she has simply delegated this to you. The wife should take control, control of all matters and the husband should obey her in all matters. She then decides what non-supervised responsibilities he is capable of and can handle as well as responsibilities that require supervision. And she gives them to him at her pleasure. All issues of control are for the woman to decide and the man to accept. We have to remember all this is about doing what our wife wants, not what we want. If she wants you to handle the finances, then that is a duty you owe her.

And you are right about the financial control. No, she didn't use physical force. I always have a choice. But if I choose against her will, it means no sexual release for six months. I have resisted twice and suffered through that. I did not resist her financial control. She is much more capable than I am and we are much better off with her in control. I understand what you are alluding too and all relationships will be different. However in my opinion it is the Wife who decides what the path for the husband will be. He can't "top from the bottom". We can discuss it, wonder about it, and use our intellect to create but in the end it is the Wife who lays down the path for the husband to follow.

Power of Attorney

You may want to consider a power of attorney. All couples should have one each for the other anyway. Both of us have signed one. I have a complete power of attorney to act in all matters on behalf of my wife. She has the same from me. We keep them in a safety deposit box. Should she become disabled, I can act on her behalf, and, of course, the same is true in reverse.
Yes, I could get the power of attorney and do as I pleased even while she is in good health. But I never would touch it without her permission or unless she became disabled. If I did, it would be the last thing I did as a married man. But it protects both of us should the need arise.

As between you and your wife, I do suggest you execute a power of attorney in her favor over all of your affairs. This gives her absolute and complete control. She can use it as she sees fit and never needs your permission for anything she wants to do. You should also be getting everything into her name alone. But before doing so, you may want to check with an attorney to make sure (depending on your assets) that you don't lose your estate exception in the event of your death because you don't have anything in your estate. That can be worked out, especially if your wife has power of attorney over any assets in your name.

Who Pays?

If we go to a fast food place, she studies the menu overhead a second, tells me what she wants, hands me money (usually a ten or twenty) and goes to take a seat. I order, get the food and bring to her. I give her the change. Sometimes she tells me to keep it or at least a portion of it. Like if she gave me a twenty and the meal was seven dollars or so, she may just take the ten and let me have the rest.
When we go to any type sit-down-and-order place to eat, we almost always pay by credit card. I take the check, look it over, add on the tip and give it to my wife who signs and gives it back to me.

As for ordering, I take my cue from her. We study the menu together. The waiter/waitress of course always asks for her order first. She gives her order. Sometimes she goes ahead and orders for me with no comment. Sometimes she asks me if I want her to order for me. I have never dared say no in front of the waiter.
Sometimes she places her order and stops. The waiter turns to me and I place my order. About half the time when I do this she will say something like, “I don't think you will like that, why don't you try so and so?” If she says that, I try what she suggests because I know she wants to sample it. If we are having wine, she always orders that.
We have been doing it this way for years. Any time we eat out, it is a pleasure for me, no cooking, no cleaning up and etc. I just take my cue from her and go with it. If we are in a real fancy upbeat place, especially if it is French or something, she always orders for both of us after we have looked over the menu together. I have a hard time even understanding some of the menu items and am grateful she does this. She knows what I like.
All this seems very normal to me. I am certainly comfortable with it. The main thing for me is to do what she wants and be a gentleman about it.

Advice and Encouragement

Until you get married, it is my opinion you should not give your girlfriend control of your finances. It is ok, even good, for her to be made fully aware of them and even to approve or disapprove of expenditures. You can heed her advice or not. But if you want to do it, then do it. If she is after your money, she will get it and dispose of you soon enough. Be prepared for that. It could really hurt. For now maybe it is best that you let her teach and guide you in financial matters. Try your best to abide by her advice and wishes. Learn from her. When you get married give yourself and all you have to her control. Once you get married it (in my opinion) changes. If she wants control of the finances, she should have it. I have never regretted (well not true) my wife having absolute financial control. It gives her a tremendous amount of power over me but I trust her and I respect the power she has. I would not want it any other way. If she takes over, I hope it is something you really want. Believe me, it will give her control that you may at times wish she didn't have and it will put you at her mercy more than you know. But, overall, I firmly recommend it.
Do you have plans to turn over financial control to her? Looks like all the other husbands here still have some if not all control in this area except for me. However, I strongly agree with all the comments that say you should handle them as your wife wants to, not as you want to.

Surrendering Too Much, Going Too Far?

All my money goes directly into her personal checking account. I have no access to it. In our state if a spouse dies the other gets a year’s support from the estate without the worry of probate or anything else.
About signing your house over to your wife. You may be able to do that without a lawyer. All you need is a quick claim deed. Sign it over then go to the court house and have it recorded. When I had to sign mine over to my wife, she did have a lawyer friend of hers provide her with the deed. I signed it and we both went to the courthouse to record it. It has been several years but it was not difficult or expensive at all. I know a few on this site disagree, but I think the wife having full and final financial control of all assets is very important. You can't be fully submissive if you can control any aspect of the finances. It is a tough thing to give up but the feeling of being completely under her authority is well worth it.

I think if I had been "screwed" by an ex-wife or two, I would certainly take steps to protect myself. I also acknowledge my wife could "screw" me. If she does I know I wouldn't let any other woman do it again if I could help it. But I have total trust in her, total. How do you handle your finances or does your wife control that also? From what I have seen posted I am one of the few men here who seem to have no actual control in this area and am forced to live on whatever allowance my wife decides is best for me.
Yes, she could take everything we have. In my mind it all belongs to her anyway. She is free to do as she pleases with it. If she took it all and left me, I could survive. I trust her to do right by me. If she doesn't, it is because she doesn't want to. That is her decision. I will live by it.

Let’s face it, odds are you will die before your wife, most men do. You do not want her to be alone with no experience in finances. Even men who are not man enough to submit to their wives should arrange to have them in control of the money or at least equal partners so she will be able to carry on.
Yes, money is power. If your wife controls it, she has that power. You have to trust her. I do. But she does as she pleases with the money. Most of the time I don't even know what that is. My biggest financial problem is trying to figure a way to get an extra $5 a week for my allowance and to avoid her reducing it if I fail to please her. I consider myself lucky to have such a small problem.

Final Thoughts

If your wife does not want complete financial control, you should not force it. The idea is to do what she wants. But regardless, it should evolve to where you don't spend any money other than your allowance without her approval. Meanwhile, she should evolve to the point where she knows she need not ask or seek your permission for anything.

We have to remember all this is about doing what our wife wants, not what we want. If she wants you to handle the finances, then that is a duty you owe her.

If your wife wants you to handle the finances, then your doing so is part of your submission to her will. In any marriage one partner is usually better suited to handling the money and that partner should be the one who has most of the responsibility (provided the wife wants it that way). If your wife wants you to handle the finances, you should.

I personally don't think any freedom you give up to favor your wife and increase your service to her should be left to fantasy. Move forward in your submission and don't be afraid to give her all the control she wants.

(End of Two-Part Posting)


Kathy said...

Thank you sweetie for a very nice posting. There are some things in life that make me angry.

One of the things that makes me very angry is when a man tells a wife that he wants to submit to her authoity, but than places limits on the way he will submit.

A man with too much money in his pocket is a problem waiting to happen.

Love, Kathy

Mark Remond said...

Thank you, Mistress Kathy. I agree -- I still get in trouble when I only have $10 or $20 in pocket!

Anonymous said...


My wife did not give
me that choice. She
took financial control,
she did not ask for it.

No, she didn't use
physical force. I
always have a choice.
But if I choose against
her will, it means no
sexual release for six

I would call this nonconsensual. forcing someone to give up control by denying him release is not a real choice. it is blackmail.

and about this financial-control-thing in relationships. I agree, it is a wise desision to not granting your girlfriend financial control. she could run away with all your money.
but why is a marriage different? in marriages she can leave you as well. and after a divorce you will get in serious financial troubles.


Anonymous said...

My girlfriend manages my finances. We aren't married (yet) and she makes a point to differentiate between manage and control.

She set up two bank accounts for me. My name is on the account but she has signature authority over them. She is the only one that knows the on-line passwords.

I have a debit card for one account. We keep $250 in this account and it's primarily for emergency situations. Also, if I need to buy a big dollar item, something like airline tickets, she will transfer the money into the account to cover the cost.

My direct deposit goes into the other account. While it's still my account, I am not "allowed" access to it. We both know that the money is still mine, but she decides how it is spent. My portion of the bills are paid from this account as are my various loan payments (I still have car and student loan payments).

Every Monday, she gives me $100 in cash. But then every Monday evening, we go out and have dinner with three to four of her girl friends. They all know about our relationship and it's sort of a little ritual we have. She'll order something simple for me (a soup or salad) and I basically wait as they eat their meals and socialize. She'll signal me when it's my time to leave, and I'll pay the bill then go wait in the car.

My allowance is really what's left over from the $100 after paying for their dinners. It usually ends up being around $20 per week. Sometimes she'll encourage them to break their diets and order desserts. When she does that, I usually have to use money saved from the previous week to pay the bill. One time I didn't have enough surpluses from the previous week and had to use the debit card. She docked my allowance the two following weeks to replenish it.

She does occasionally take liberties with how she manages my money. She's occasionally informed me that I've 'treated' her and one of her friends to session at the day spa. Then she'll point out that I spent the past three days at work so they could enjoy a couple hours of relaxation.

You've advised against allowing girlfriends financial control. But in my case, prior to her taking over, my finances were in the crapper (I was wasting money and was habitually late on credit cards and stuff). I'm also young enough that even if she does take everything, it's not as if I've got a whole lot of time invested in it. And like you and your wife, I really have no reason to not trust her. She seems to enjoy doing things to remind me how much control she has over me. And her enjoyment is what I have found ends up making me the happiest.

I also believe that since she owns my time, my employer is really paying her to have me work there.

Mark Remond said...

Anonymous, I think this is one of the most exciting comments this blog has seen in its three-plus years. Exciting especially because you are embarking on your FLR at such an early age, with so many delightful decades ahead of you if, as perhaps we both hope, your girlfriend consolidates her loving authority over you by taking you to husband.

Many, if not most of the FLR bloggers and commenters I’m familiar with seem to have converted to this lifestyle after many years of marriage, in their mid-forties, fifties and even beyond. Many seem to be empty-nesters, especially those who are privileged to live in an FLR 24/7. And I doubt not that most of them—I’m talking about guys now --would share my envy of you for coming so thoroughly under your girlfriend’s control so early.

I hope that you will comment or email in future, with updates about your evolving relationship. As I said, with so many years ahead, and your girlfriend demonstrating such a fertile imagination (like those Monday-night dinners with her girlfriends) in her “management” of you (as opposed to “control”), the possibilities ahead for both of you seem almost limitless… and truly exciting.

I also commend you for realizing how you are prospering under her judicious financial management—even if she does restrict you to a meager allowance. I would like to see a survey of just how many wives, whether in official wife-led marriages or out, take control of hubby’s paycheck, for exactly the reason that your girlfriend has done.

By the way, I don’t recall ever having advised against having a girlfriend take financial control. I have certainly read such advice, and understand the commonsensical reasons for it. As Lady Misato observed, “It is possible for a woman to exercise erotic power within a long-term non-marital arrangement but outside of marriage, there is a) a temptation on the part of the man to seek an easier resolution, and b) no committed relationship into which to invest.”

Finally, because I am so intrigued by your comment, and I want to share it with more of my blog followers, I propose to include it in a new post in the next day or so. Again, thank you, and keep us all posted!

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