Sunday, October 21, 2012


Carol is the CEO and part owner of the privately held software company where I work. Carol is an assertive, driven feminist with a quick temper who has but one goal in life and that is to expand her business. Given my female-led lifestyle at home, Carol creates an environment I thrive in! Carol is younger than I am, and I mentored her when she joined our company out of college. Carol was promoted by our company's prior corporate owners and was in a position to become a shareholder when we were divested. Largely because of my “feminist credentials” and my willingness to take on a subordinate role to her, Carol took me with her as she climbed the corporate ladder; it has been a mutually beneficial and satisfying arrangement.

Carol is a driver behind the efforts we make to recruit, develop, and promote women. No matter the open position, she asks whether we have a woman who could fill it; usually we do since it's one of my jobs to see that we do and a job that I energetically pursue. Our company is always seeking to promote women since women are grossly underrepresented in technology fields.

Carol and I are friends but I recognize her authority and my subordination to her and the other board members. Our board is all-female with the exception for myself and another man, my friend, Tom. We are not officers of the company as are the women; rather, our roles are to support the officers and mentor and assist women who are nearing promotion.

In addition to my subordinate business roles, I make it a point to look after Carol, show her respect, and tend to her ongoing needs. I always show her deference no matter where our meeting is or who is in attendance; she will always get a “Yes, Ma’am” in response to a request, whether it's for some complex financial numbers or a cup of coffee. I make it a point to have a variety of coffees and teas available for Carol and the board members and serve them as needed.

When I first met Carol I called her by her first name, but as she moved up the ranks it was more appropriate that I address her more formally. I now address her as “Ma’am” or “Madame”; we are both comfortable with this. The manner in which I address her is a way of punctuating our relative roles, something that, as a strong woman and a submissive man, we are always wanting to do. I am always looking to take on more for her. I make copies, serve coffee, and tend to her dry cleaning, picking it up and delivering it once a week. I've done light housekeeping for her when her usual household help has been unavailable. I accompany her on trips where I'll do anything from help her with important presentations and client meetings to carry her bags, act as her chauffeur, run errands, and even sew a button on her jacket or iron a blouse. Her time is much too valuable to tend to trivial matters, so these fall to me. All said, work is an extension of my home life; the female-led lifestyle I have at home has prepared me for the subordinate role I have at my female-led company.


Anonymous said...

I understand taht you as a submissive male seek out and prefer to work and interact with dominant women but are you and your Wife not worried that yoru service may be being given because ti sexually satisfies both you and your boss.

Does your intelectual acknowldgement of your subservient postition have a sexual side and do you attempt to subdue this.

I too find female boses exciting but I always want to keep things on a professional level and not to be a do me sub for want of a better expression.

My subservience is there to helpp them not to service either of our kinks and certainly least of all mine.


Anonymous said...

Does she know the female led dynamic is in your private life? Does she know she is pushing your submissive buttons or simply see you as an efficient, attentive work colleague?

Picking up her dry cleaning and ironing her blouses does seem above and beyond the call of duty or does she get off on this kind of thing.. Would she ask you to shine her shoes, give her a foot rub or a shoulder rub for instance? I know you would love it, lol, but would she see that as appropriate or does she keep it on a more professional level?

Mark Remond said...


'm delighted with the postings of Nancy & Dennis, and they certainly don't need me to speak for them. But I can't resist citing the following exchange from the Spousechat Archives linked on my home page about whether a male subordinate should be doing personal errands for his female boss:

If Charles was my secretary, he'd have to wear tailored suits and have impeccable grooming. He'd have my coffee and Wall Street Journal on my desk before I arrived for work. He would take dictation. He would have to make all of my personal appointments such as hair, nails and tanning for me. He would call me Ms. S, and answer "yes ma'am" when given an instruction. He would accompany me to business meetings to carry my briefcase for me. He would run all types of errands for me, both business and personal. He would pick up and drop off my dry cleaning, get my car washed, and shop for me when I needed him too... Interested in the job????

Ms. Jennifer, Actually, at my last job, I did nearly all of these things for my boss. Her name was Susan and she was truly an incredible woman. Although she was a very demanding woman, she actually made it a pleasure to do all of these things for her.

Anonymous said...

Your gender and your boss' gender shouldn't play into the question of whether particular work is appropriate or not.

It boils down to who is the person/entity paying you. If your boss is the one paying you, then doing personal errands for them could fall within the scope of your employment. If someone else is paying you (eg stock holders), then it would be inappropriate to be doing personal errands for your boss on company time. The exception would be if such tasks were explicitly included as part of your job.

The company cannot legally deduct your salary from their taxes if you're doing personal work for your boss.

Nancy and Dennis said...

Anonymous ("Does she know the female led dynamic is in your private life?")

Carol and Nancy are friends, executive woman to executive woman. Carol is aware of our lifestyle and sees it for what it is, my supporting Nancy's career and taking on a domestic role in support of her. As far as Carol pushing buttons, this is not the case. We are on a purely professional footing. As far as the things I do for her, they are no more than what many female administrative assistants do for their manager. Serving coffee, picking up dry cleaning - yes; anything more that you mention, NO, we don't won't go there.

Nancy and Dennis said...

First Anonymous Comment -

My wife and my boss are good friends. My relationship with Carol is on a professional level no matter that I perform small services for her. Nothing wrong with making coffee and running errands. As far as how I view Carol, I admire her for being a strong and capable woman in what had traditionally been a man's world. I am also grateful for her giving me the professional opportunities that she has.

Kathy said...

Enjoyed reading the posting.

For me female led relationships are about the home; the dynamics between a husband and wife. It is not about the work place.

In the work place I believe in equality between men and women with opportunities based on merit rather than gender.

In the workplace it is important for me to know that my son has equal opportunities with his female associates. In the home it is a different matter. In the home a man makes the choice to submit to his wife's authoity. In the workplace he dosen't have that choice.

I continue to believe that true femdom relationships are only for a small number of people. Yet, for men who have the need to actually serve the female gender, not simply role play, FLM is a healthy way of life.

If my son were submissve and had the courage to openly serve a mistress wife I would be completly supportive of them. This, however, is a home and family decision.


Nancy and Dennis said...

Ms. Kathy -

We're glad that you enjoyed our posting and appreciate your point of view. Our perspective is that female authority can -– and should -- extend to all facets of society, all professions, all endeavors. While we appreciate your desire for equality between genders, the sad fact is that there has been no equality; men have been firmly in charge, and would still be, were it not for Feminism and programs such as affirmative action. Until the rise of Feminism women, no matter their qualifications, women were relegated to second place to men.

In my company, a privately held software company, opportunities for women really only emerged when our all-female board of directors bought the company. Until then it was a male-dominated domain characterized by lesser-qualified men leading more qualified women. There was nothing like the equality you mention. Sadly this is still the case in too many companies today. Look at the statistics concerning women's pay versus that of men or of the percentages of women versus men in managerial roles. There is a lot of room for improvement before society can approach anything like equality.

In my situation, I am subordinate to Carol simply by my position –- she is my boss. My FLM drives my behaviors with Carol in so far as the respect I show her and the things I do for her. This is not the same situation that I have at home; home is a totally different dynamic. Carol and our all-female board are in charge not simply because they are women but because they invested heavily in buying the company, they took on entrepreneurial risks and made a success of the company. Were it not for their efforts, I, and many others, would not have the jobs we have. These women deserve the respect and deference for what they have accomplished.

Incidentally, my career-long association with women has benefited me; I have a good position despite putting Nancy's career ahead of my own.

Finally, equality for us is a waypoint on the journey to more of a female value-based model for society. We believe that in many cases women are simply better leaders than men.

Anonymous said...

Dear Nancy and Dennis,

Thanks for your comments. So far you have not mentioned children. Do you have children? If so, how did you raise them to appreciate the Female Led lifestyle? How did they react? How do they live now?


Anonymous said...

Perhaps a starting point for pay for males in a Female Led society would be for the best paid male to earn one penny less than the lowest paid Female.

That way males would be suppotive of Womyn advancing themseves even more as their own pay woul dbe linked to the success of the lowest paid woman.

This would over turn the discusting state of affiars now whereby Womyn earn 13% less than their male counterparts.

Since the majority of Womyn look after children in one parent families it would also do more to allevioate poverty.


Sam said...

Although i am going back many years here, i can fully relate to your position in a pro-female company. When i left college I worked for an advertising agency as an illustrator. The company was originally owned by one woman and two men, within three years of my working there both men retired and the sole owner 'Mrs Harris'not a young woman, made a conscious effort to employ and promote women within her company.

I worked in the studio with three other men, an office junior three years younger than myself was employed, Anna, just as everything started going computerized. She steadily, and looking back, easily outperformed all four of us men. In the couple of years that followed two of the guys i worked with were replaced by one more qualified woman. In my last year there Anna became the studio manager, from then on i respectfully addressed her as Ms Davies until i left.


Nancy and Dennis said...

Sam - Thank you for your posting. You had some very good experience with a female-run enterprise. While I work at a a female-run company, the women who come into our organization are not guaranteed success - they earn it by their performance, and most of the women I've encountered can easily outperform two or more men. When the women first secured ownership of our firm, many women were promoted and there was an assumption among some of the men that women were promoted simply because they were female - not the case! Women were initially promoted in such large numbers because, in the past, MEN were promoted because of the good-old-boy network at the expense of more qualified women. What you saw, one women doing the work of two or more men, was our experience, too. And the women did a better job as well; a better job by any measure. We find that women generally do a much better job of managing highly motivated and educated staff since women are more open to discussion and collaboration than are many men.

There is an old adage that says that "a woman has to do a job twice as well as a man to be thought of as doing half as much." Sadly, this is still true in some quarters, and it's why successful women executives and professionals want to have their accomplishments and abilities recognized. As someone who's worked for feminist goals, I'm happy to see women advance and acknowledge what they have accomplished. "Yes, Ma-am," "Good morning, Ms Stevens," and a good cup of coffee go a long way and I make sure that men coming into our company know it.

website said...

Trying would always be the best.

Anonymous said...

I have noticed that in our office all the calendars have gone down of scantilly clad women and lots of half naked and fully but tastefully done naked males have replaced them.

There are both subtle put downs for males and also rewarding encouragements too.Male egos need not be assuaged or pandered too anymore and have been placed firmly in a box labelled "not wanted"

Teh place works far better now and there is no going back to the old days.


Nancy and Dennis said...

Dear Anonymous (aka Femsup) -

Gone are the days when calendars of scantily clad women adorned the cubicles of male professionals. In fact, such items have even been banished from blue-collar environments, too. Businesses want to make the work environment as comfortable as possible for women, and my experience is that companies will take whatever steps necessary to make this happen. Women are making their way into both professional and blue-collar occupations and aren't going to tolerate such things - nor should they.

On the same line women are going to make their personal space reflect their taste and if, as you say, "tastefully done" male model calendars are put up, then so be it.

Now if women see something that offends them, then they should complain and get action. Men can complain too, but I think it would be rather hard to build a case against a Chippendale calendar in a woman's cubicle. I would think that male complaints about what women may put up would be driven not from any moral perspective, nor from an argument that the woman was creating a 'hostile environment' but rather from bruised male egos, egos long overinflated from centuries of patriarchy. Male egos are definitely not to be pandered to.

Anonymous said...

Very well put.


Sam said...

Although I left that company, I do believe my days there where numbered. I couldn't even hope to compete with their efficiency and intellect. As you say one woman can often outperform numerous men…I can clearly remember my father coming home and announcing he was being retired early along with three other men…one woman and her computer took their place!

My girlfriend’s niece was recently gloating, quite rightly, that at schools and Universities, not just hers; that girls are seriously outnumbering and outperforming the boys. We believe that now girls are encouraged these days just as much as boys to think of their futures and achieve the best exam results…the girls are way ahead in all subjects! Boys are apparently struggling to get exam results that girls were making many years ago! Even with extra encouragement for the boys, the gap continues to grow.


Nancy and Dennis said...

Sam -
What you mention is part of an ongoing trend, at least in western countries. Women are pursuing college and post-graduate education in record numbers, often outnumbering men. At the masters degree level, for example, women earn about 60% of degrees granted, degrees such as MBAs that are powerful qualifications and tickets to high-paying jobs traditionally held by men. There are other things to consider, too. Women need to have financial independence; the old model of women marring and having a life of security always was a fantasy and it's much less prevalent today. Additionally, many female-only jobs, that is 'pink collar' jobs, pay substandard wages so women can't rely on these. The solution is for women to get professional-level qualifications and move into the workforce where many of them find a great deal of success.

Anonymous said...

I love the idea of female executives displaying calendars of male models in their offices. It's a symbol of power or control. The calendars depict men modeling underwear - boxer briefs, perhaps. They are incredibly fit and well-muscled complete with tight, washboard abs...and of course, they ALL have a conspicuously large bulge in their briefs. When the female executive meets with any male subordinate, he would quickly understand that she is dominant and in control of men - that she objectifies and controls men the way men once objectified and controlled women. Any modern, empowered woman should proudly display photos of extremely attractive, scantily-clad, and obviously well-endowed men on their office walls. It's a symbol of their success and power, as if all strong/successful women have keep harems of men for their pleasure. Any man who sees such images displayed in the office of a female executive will immediately know his place.